3. Rebirth of Whom?
1. The most difficult question is Rebirth of Whom.
2. Does the same dead person take a new birth ?
3. Did the Buddha believe in this thesis ? The answer is " Most improbable."
4. The answer depends upon the elements of existence of the dead man meeting together and forming a new body then the possibility of the Rebirth of the same Sentient being is possible.
5. If a new body is formed after a mixture or the different elements of the different men who are dead then there is rebirth but not the rebirth of the same sentient being.
6. This point has been well explained by sister Khema to King Pasenadi.
7. Once the Exalted One was staying near Savatthi at Jeta Grove in Anathapindika's Aram.
8. Now on that occasion the sister Khema, after going her rounds among the Kosalana, took up her quarters at Toranavatthu, between Shravasti and Saketa.
9. Now the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was journeying from Saketa to Shravasti, and midway between Saketa and Shravasti he put up for one night at Toranavatthu.
10. The Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala called a certain man and said : " Come thou, good fellow ! Find out some recluse or brahmin such that I can wait upon him today."
11. " Even so, your majesty," said that man in reply to the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala, and after wandering through all Toranavatthu he saw not any one, either recluse or brahmin, on whom the Rajah Pasenadi might wait.
12. Then that man saw the sister Khema, who had come to reside at Toranavatthu. And on seeing her he went back to the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala, and said:—
13. "Your Majesty, there is no recluse or brahmin in Toranavatthu such that your majesty can wait upon him. But, your majesty, there is a sister named Khema, a woman-disciple of that Exalted One. Now of this lady a lovely rumour has gone abroad, that she is sage, accomplished, shrewd, widely learned, a brilliant talker, of goodly ready wit. Let your majesty wait upon her."
14. So the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala went to visit the sister Khema, and on coming to her saluted and sat down at one side. So seated he said to her:—
15. " How say you, lady ? Does the Tathagata exist after death ? "
16. " That also, maharajah is not revealed by the Exalted One."
17. " How then, lady ? When asked ' Does the Tathagata exist after death?' you reply, "That is not revealed by the Exalted One,' and, when I ask . . . the other questions, you make the same reply. Pray, lady, what is the reason, what is the cause, why this thing is not revealed by the Exalted One ? "
18. "Now in this matter, maharajah, I will question you. Do you reply as you think fit. Now how say you, maharajah ? Have you some accountant, some ready reckoner or calculator, able to count the sand in Ganges, thus : There are so many hundred grains, or so many thousand grains, or so many hundreds of thousands of grains of sand ? "
19. " No, indeed, lady."
20. " Then have you some accountant, ready reckoner or calculator able to reckon the water in the mighty ocean, thus : There are so many gallons of water, so many hundreds, so many thousands, so many hundreds of thousand gallons of water ? "
21. "No, indeed, lady."
22. " How is that ? "
23. " Mighty is the ocean, lady, deep, boundless, unfathomable."
24. " Even so, maharajah, if one should try to define the Tathagata by his bodily form, that bodily form of the Tathagata is. abandoned, cut down at the root, made like a palm-tree stump, made some thing that is not, made of a nature not to spring up again in future time. Set free from reckoning as body, maharajah, is the Tathagata. He is deep, boundless unfathomable, just like the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death ' does not apply. To say, ' The Tathagata exists not after death,' does not apply. To say, ' The Tathagata both exists and exists not, neither exists nor not exists after death,' does not apply.
25. " If one should try to define the Tathagata by feeling,—that feeling of the Tathagata is abandoned, cut down at the root . . . Yet free from reckoning as feeling is the Tathagata, maharajah, deep, boundless, unfathomable like the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death . . . exists not after death,' does not apply.
26. " So also if one should try to define the Tathagata by perception, by the activities, by consciousness . . . set free from reckoning by consciousness is the Tathagata, deep, boundless, unfathomable as the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death . . . exists not after death,' does not apply."
27. Then the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was delighted with the words of the sister Khema, and took pleasure therein. And he rose from his seat, saluted her by the right and went away.
28. Now on another occasion the Rajah went to visit the Exalted One, and on coming to him saluted him and sat down at one side. So seated he said to the Exalted One:
29. " Pray, Lord, does the Tathagata -exist after death ?"
30. " Not revealed by me, maharajah, is this matter."
31. "Then Lord, the Tathagata does not exist after death."
32. " That also, maharajah, is not revealed by —me." me.
33. He then asks the other questions and gets the same reply.
34. " How then. Lord ? When I ask the question, ' Does the Tathagata exist ? . . . does he not exist after death ? ' you reply, ' It is not revealed by me.' Pray, Lord, what is the reason, what is the cause why this thing is not revealed by the Exalted One ? "
35. " Now, maharajah, I will question you. Do you reply as you think fit. Now what say you, maharajah? Have you some accountant . . . (the rest is exactly as before).'
36. " Wonderful, Lord! Strange it is, Lord, how the explanation both of Master and disciple, both in spirit and in letter, will agree, will harmonise, will not be inconsistent, that is, in any word about the highest.
37. " On a certain occasion. Lord, I went to visit the sister Khema, and asked her the meaning of this matter, and she gave me the meaning in the very words, in the very syllables used by the Exalted One. Wonderful, Lord! Strange it is. Lord, how the explanation both of Master and disciple will agree, will harmonise, in spirit and in letter, how they will not be inconsistent,—that is, in any word about the highest.
38. " Well, Lord, now we must be going. We are busy folk. We have many things to do.
39. " Do now what you think it is time for, maharajah."
40. Thereupon the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was delighted with the words of the Exalted One and welcomed them. And he rose from his seat, saluted the Exalted One by the right and went away.
1. The most difficult question is Rebirth of Whom.
2. Does the same dead person take a new birth ?
3. Did the Buddha believe in this thesis ? The answer is " Most improbable."
4. The answer depends upon the elements of existence of the dead man meeting together and forming a new body then the possibility of the Rebirth of the same Sentient being is possible.
5. If a new body is formed after a mixture or the different elements of the different men who are dead then there is rebirth but not the rebirth of the same sentient being.
6. This point has been well explained by sister Khema to King Pasenadi.
7. Once the Exalted One was staying near Savatthi at Jeta Grove in Anathapindika's Aram.
8. Now on that occasion the sister Khema, after going her rounds among the Kosalana, took up her quarters at Toranavatthu, between Shravasti and Saketa.
9. Now the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was journeying from Saketa to Shravasti, and midway between Saketa and Shravasti he put up for one night at Toranavatthu.
10. The Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala called a certain man and said : " Come thou, good fellow ! Find out some recluse or brahmin such that I can wait upon him today."
11. " Even so, your majesty," said that man in reply to the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala, and after wandering through all Toranavatthu he saw not any one, either recluse or brahmin, on whom the Rajah Pasenadi might wait.
12. Then that man saw the sister Khema, who had come to reside at Toranavatthu. And on seeing her he went back to the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala, and said:—
13. "Your Majesty, there is no recluse or brahmin in Toranavatthu such that your majesty can wait upon him. But, your majesty, there is a sister named Khema, a woman-disciple of that Exalted One. Now of this lady a lovely rumour has gone abroad, that she is sage, accomplished, shrewd, widely learned, a brilliant talker, of goodly ready wit. Let your majesty wait upon her."
14. So the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala went to visit the sister Khema, and on coming to her saluted and sat down at one side. So seated he said to her:—
15. " How say you, lady ? Does the Tathagata exist after death ? "
16. " That also, maharajah is not revealed by the Exalted One."
17. " How then, lady ? When asked ' Does the Tathagata exist after death?' you reply, "That is not revealed by the Exalted One,' and, when I ask . . . the other questions, you make the same reply. Pray, lady, what is the reason, what is the cause, why this thing is not revealed by the Exalted One ? "
18. "Now in this matter, maharajah, I will question you. Do you reply as you think fit. Now how say you, maharajah ? Have you some accountant, some ready reckoner or calculator, able to count the sand in Ganges, thus : There are so many hundred grains, or so many thousand grains, or so many hundreds of thousands of grains of sand ? "
19. " No, indeed, lady."
20. " Then have you some accountant, ready reckoner or calculator able to reckon the water in the mighty ocean, thus : There are so many gallons of water, so many hundreds, so many thousands, so many hundreds of thousand gallons of water ? "
21. "No, indeed, lady."
22. " How is that ? "
23. " Mighty is the ocean, lady, deep, boundless, unfathomable."
24. " Even so, maharajah, if one should try to define the Tathagata by his bodily form, that bodily form of the Tathagata is. abandoned, cut down at the root, made like a palm-tree stump, made some thing that is not, made of a nature not to spring up again in future time. Set free from reckoning as body, maharajah, is the Tathagata. He is deep, boundless unfathomable, just like the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death ' does not apply. To say, ' The Tathagata exists not after death,' does not apply. To say, ' The Tathagata both exists and exists not, neither exists nor not exists after death,' does not apply.
25. " If one should try to define the Tathagata by feeling,—that feeling of the Tathagata is abandoned, cut down at the root . . . Yet free from reckoning as feeling is the Tathagata, maharajah, deep, boundless, unfathomable like the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death . . . exists not after death,' does not apply.
26. " So also if one should try to define the Tathagata by perception, by the activities, by consciousness . . . set free from reckoning by consciousness is the Tathagata, deep, boundless, unfathomable as the mighty ocean. To say, ' The Tathagata exists after death . . . exists not after death,' does not apply."
27. Then the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was delighted with the words of the sister Khema, and took pleasure therein. And he rose from his seat, saluted her by the right and went away.
28. Now on another occasion the Rajah went to visit the Exalted One, and on coming to him saluted him and sat down at one side. So seated he said to the Exalted One:
29. " Pray, Lord, does the Tathagata -exist after death ?"
30. " Not revealed by me, maharajah, is this matter."
31. "Then Lord, the Tathagata does not exist after death."
32. " That also, maharajah, is not revealed by —me." me.
33. He then asks the other questions and gets the same reply.
34. " How then. Lord ? When I ask the question, ' Does the Tathagata exist ? . . . does he not exist after death ? ' you reply, ' It is not revealed by me.' Pray, Lord, what is the reason, what is the cause why this thing is not revealed by the Exalted One ? "
35. " Now, maharajah, I will question you. Do you reply as you think fit. Now what say you, maharajah? Have you some accountant . . . (the rest is exactly as before).'
36. " Wonderful, Lord! Strange it is, Lord, how the explanation both of Master and disciple, both in spirit and in letter, will agree, will harmonise, will not be inconsistent, that is, in any word about the highest.
37. " On a certain occasion. Lord, I went to visit the sister Khema, and asked her the meaning of this matter, and she gave me the meaning in the very words, in the very syllables used by the Exalted One. Wonderful, Lord! Strange it is. Lord, how the explanation both of Master and disciple will agree, will harmonise, in spirit and in letter, how they will not be inconsistent,—that is, in any word about the highest.
38. " Well, Lord, now we must be going. We are busy folk. We have many things to do.
39. " Do now what you think it is time for, maharajah."
40. Thereupon the Rajah Pasenadi of Kosala was delighted with the words of the Exalted One and welcomed them. And he rose from his seat, saluted the Exalted One by the right and went away.
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